227: Shifting Perceptions of Guns in Media with Actor Adam Brody

How can storytellers in media play a critical role in preventing gun violence? Actor Adam Brody joins us to share his insights on Hollywood's influence on gun culture and the power of storytelling to change hearts and minds. As an actor, Adam recognizes the impact that the stories we tell can have on shaping people's perceptions and the importance of having a higher level of conversation about gun violence, similar to the conversations we're finally having about gender and minority representation.

We discuss the needs to challenge cultural myths and present the risks and consequences of gun violence in a way that isn't threatening, and the potential of storytellers to make a difference in the fight against gun violence.

Further Reading:
Hollywood Actors, Directors, Creators Discuss Gun Safety (Brady)
Gun Guidelines for the Media (Hollywood Health and Society)
'Yellowstone' and Hollywood's Quiet Pivot to Showing Gun Safety Onscreen (the Ankler)
Adam Brody, Piper Perabo and More Call for Less Gun Violence on Screen at White House Roundtable: ‘Hollywood Has Been Due for a Reckoning’ (Variety)
Wrap Roundtable: Adam Brody Calls Out Onscreen Gun Violence as Big Part of the Problem – ‘American as Apple Pie’ (the Wrap)

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:08

This is the legal disclaimer, where I tell you that the views, thoughts and opinions shared on this podcast belong solely to our guests and hosts and not necessarily Brady or Brady's affiliates. Please note this podcast contains discussions of violence that some people may find disturbing. It's okay, we find it disturbing too. Hey, everybody, welcome back to another episode of Red Bull and Brady. I'm one of your hosts, jj, and today we're bringing you episode two in our Show Your Safety series. As you would know from the previous episode, which I know you've all listened to, show Your Safety is Brady's new initiative where we're using the power of storytellers in media to fight gun violence through all different sorts of avenues. Today, kelly and I had the privilege to sit down with actor Adam Brody. You've seen him on TV, you've seen him in the movies and now you're going to see him as an activist. We're going to start with Har's question. Can you introduce yourself?

Speaker 2: 1:21

Adam Jared Brody of the San Diego Brody's. I've been an actor for 24 years and that's me. Well, an activist too, i dabble, i shout from my living room. But I don't know what constitutes being an activist, but I don't feel I've earned that label. But I'm happy for the opportunity. I'm happy to be here and try it. I'm just happy for the opportunity to help in any way I can.

Speaker 1: 1:57

I feel like being an activist, though it's on a spectrum. I think just being a participant is enough. Then, of course, there's, i think, the folks that we meet all the time who are like, i would say, like capital A Yeah yeah, yeah, like I've made it their life's work.

Speaker 2: 2:09

Yeah, i am thankful for them. I envy them, i'm not, but you know.

Speaker 1: 2:16

It was room for everybody.

Speaker 2: 2:17

Maybe someday It's not too late.

Speaker 3: 2:22

Well, for today. we said you're here, we're in DC, for people who don't know. So could you tell us why you're in DC with Brady this week and how you became interested and involved in efforts to prevent gun violence?

Speaker 2: 2:34

Sure, Well, I mean, in terms of gun violence in general, it's one of those things. I mean I have a lot of political and thoughts and humanist thoughts. To me it's the most flagrant. I mean, it's the easiest fix, It's the biggest cell phone, It's the most embarrassing, but that's not the point. I don't care. It's the biggest abomination because of how simple, in a way, the problem is. I don't mean the solutions to get where we need to get are simple. The roadmap to get there is difficult and clogged, but we're unique in this way. So we have other case tests that prove that you don't have to live like this and we are literally and metaphorically well. I don't want to use any violent language, but It's really hard, though actually We have the sound of the podcast.

Speaker 2: 3:36

I was having this talk. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of gun metaphor in.

Speaker 1: 3:38

English language. It's built into our culture to the point where it's linguistically like it's there for everything.

Speaker 2: 3:45

So I mean, of all the causes, this is the one I sort of were willfully. Not only are so many, I mean again, it's the number one cause of death for children, anyways. So there's that and it makes me want to scream and it seems like, of course I don't want to deny, some segments of the population are affected much more than others, but this is something that you can't totally buy your way out of. I mean, this is weird. It's like domestic terrorism. We're willingly letting this happen willfully.

Speaker 2: 4:20

Anyways, those are some of my basic thoughts about gun violence And then, more specifically, hollywood and our culture and the stories we tell. I think Hollywood is due for a real look in the mirror about our influence and our influence on promoting it. I think Hollywood is making much better gun commercials than the gun companies themselves or the NRA or any of these asshole politicians. There's no question in my mind that a lot of the attraction and sex appeal comes from the movies and shows and stories we tell. And so I don't want to sound like a prude, i don't want to be a prude and I don't want to be a censor, and at the same time I totally think smoking. We minimized it, then had some rules and got rid of it. You can't smoke in an outdoor advertising campaign. You can't smoke if it's not or rated R movie, and it's to me. We're living through this epidemic and something of that magnitude is in order, and I think it would do a lot of good as well as just.

Speaker 2: 5:35

I wish I didn't have to call it Hollywood, but we know what we mean when I mean have just a higher level of conversation, in the same way that we're finally having it long overdue on gender and minority representation. When we tell stories now, we're much more conscious of these things than we were five years ago or a decade ago, and I just feel like we haven't even begun the work on guns yet. But if we could, that's a power we have. We can't force any laws yet, but we can change some hearts and minds, and clearly something's broken in the hearts and minds of this country, because I know that there's, as I understand it, there's a minority. You know, i understand that the majority want safer, safer restrictions, less guns, et cetera, but and I understand that we have a bit of a minority rule in this country for various reasons, but even so, the majority that wants it. It's not so overwhelming that we're voting these people out of office. That won't, because they won't change the laws. I mean, we still have a pretty divided, divided politicians, and so I still think like we need to do more work And at least that's where perhaps we can come in in terms of changing the culture, and so, yeah, anyways, that said, brady, through Twitter, reached out to me because I've been a bit vocal about this stuff And and I was thankful for the opportunity to come And we, you know it was kind of a brainstorming session really, but and and while I'm very much here for that and I'm very much here for because I think there's a myriad of ways, you know, a lot of it was about safe gun storage pretty, you know, if you're gonna, we're not gonna get rid of guns and movies, but let's think about storing them more safely.

Speaker 2: 7:13

And I think all, all ideas, there's a million ways to chip away at this and the way we depict it or not depict it, and and culturally, And so I think there's a lot of good ideas there, but for me, more than even, you know, brainstorming or coming out with any specific plan, and just just raising awareness of it's time to have the conversation and look at it with a harder lens.

Speaker 1: 7:39

I think you know there's. There's a lot that I think that you that you brought up. That we're gonna discuss in a second. But one of the things that we had discussed with Matt Nix on the podcast was this idea of like smoking went in movies and in TV shows from being the thing that like cool noir detective did to like that was like the bumbling low class like. There was this culture shift of smoking wasn't what heroes did, right. So is there a shift and that can be also be done with like showing firearms and things like. It's not. I think it's used as a signifier. So much for like. This person is a badass, this person's very masculine, this person is the guy in charge. Why? Because he's got the gun, he's got the gun skills. So maybe there's a norm shift, even within content. That can be done.

Speaker 2: 8:19

There's a whole. Yeah, well, as you said, there's a scale or a spectrum of act activism. I think there's a spectrum of of of how you represent guns on screen and and their effectiveness. You know, and I think that's absolutely shifting it to a more negative character is one and and and again. Safe storage, making storage cool, just like seatbelt. Your hero should wear a seatbelt. You know, like, have your regular, your lead characters, put on a seatbelt when they get in the car. Same, you know they could probably have a safe. You know, have a, have a some safe storage.

Speaker 2: 8:56

And at the same time again, i hate to be like the nag in the prude of the bunch, but I also think and again, i don't make my action isn't my bread and butter, even though I dabble and I enjoy it and I watch it, i consume it.

Speaker 2: 9:09

But but I also just think like, yeah, i mean less, what about just less too? and what about? you know, in the same way, that it's like no one's saying, you know, let's get rid of all the guns, are saying like let's get rid of assault weapons and then let's have some red flag, while I was like we can, we can do things like that and there's a scale, you know, and I think we could, we, you know, even just quantity matters and and I just, if ever, before you do it, think twice, think if there's an alternative. Do I need that because it's also lazy? I mean not always. Sometimes it's essential for the writing and they are dramatic and they are cinematic, but oftentimes it's it's, it's lazy and it's a crutch, and it's much more creative to think of something deeper, or think of at least that thing deep, more deeply, and even if you are going to use it, think of it, you know, think of where it came from, think of the repercussions, etc.

Speaker 3: 10:02

And I think one thing. I could hear someone who may want it, may be in good faith, or maybe it's not, but someone might say well, so what you're saying is, it's the movies, that's the problem or it's the media. That's the problem. But we know that American movies, we are sort of the leader around the world, but only here do we have these problems.

Speaker 3: 10:23

So why do you think that you know it's particularly, there is a role to play for entertainment, but it's something about the system that we're in that really leads to the shootings that we're seeing here on Arsalao but not in the UK.

Speaker 2: 10:38

Yeah, I was having this conversation earlier, and I mean I think it, yeah, the peculiarities of our political system have the gridlock, the you know have a lot. I agree, clearly it's true that, like, we're the only ones that have this, but our movies travel and video games travel, but that's the situation we're in, you know, and I'm not even saying I don't know if it's the chicken or the egg, you know, but I'm not saying it's causing it necessarily, but I'm saying it would help if we dialed it back, because these things are a lot less sexy when Ted Cruz holds them, you know, than they are when Keanu Reeves holds them. That's a fact, you know. and Hollywood is made up of models, and you know. and so, yeah, i think stigmatizing them a little more and glamorizing them a little less would go a long way to moving the culture and the mindset and forwarding the conversation. And with doing that, ideally enough people could come over to the side to vote in a way that we could actually enact legislation. I would love to live in the world where we didn't have to worry about it.

Speaker 2: 11:36

I could still make an argument that it might be time to evolve from such a war-like mindset, but regardless, and as said, as someone again, i keep saying it but I love boxing. I love, you know, i love sport, i like combat, but in certain you know areas, but yeah, i mean regardless, i could say that it might be just time to sort of evolve anyway. but either way, this is the situation we find ourselves in and me, as an actor, what can I do? Well, i could. you know, i'm very conscious, again, of other, i'm conscious of so many things. I mean, i'm conscious of, and more and more and more all the time, of the sexism you know that's in a script I read, or et cetera. And you know, i don't feel that it's stymied. I feel like I'm a better artist, i feel like I'm a deeper thinker than I was five, 10 years ago. so I don't feel, yeah, i don't feel stymied by thinking more deeply and wisely about some of these issues and trying to tell stories without mind.

Speaker 1: 12:44

So I wonder what you would say to folks who would say well, of course then, like American movies are in media and whatnot is inherently violent because our society is violent. Do you think it's just kind of chicken and egg thing again, of just mirroring and then amplifying or.

Speaker 2: 12:59

Again, i was having this conversation earlier and we were talking about the founding of this country and you know we were sort of it was a violent rebellion and an overthrow and or you know, at least not an overthrow but a rebellion nonetheless. And you know this image of you know, very self-made and very independent and and I don't know, i don't know if that psychology and all we've, you know that mindset and that myth we've, or you know truth, but also you know we've mythologized it over the years and I don't know if that's taken such deep root that that's how we see ourselves. Yeah, chicken or the egg, is it a mirror or not? Well, i don't know, but let's work on both, you know. I mean, i guess like I would take help on either side of the, you know either side of that chicken, or the chicken or the egg and the egg. Both need help, and harder. You know I'm in the chicken business, so I'll try and help with the chicken and see if we can't get the egg to come along.

Speaker 3: 13:59

Yeah, and something kind of in the background of this conversation too is in talking about, for example, firearms being emblematic of cool right. And we've had other guests on the podcast come on and talk about gender and masculinity and the ways that for some men they may think this is a way that I will ascend to coolness. So then they buy the firearm in their home and then they end up hurting themselves. And we live in a country where most of the gun deaths are suicide and so some of these depictions too. It may be that maybe it doesn't cause someone to go out and hurt someone else, but it causes someone to go out, get a gun, have that gun and then hurt themselves when they go through a hard time.

Speaker 3: 14:38

And Brady has an initiative called Show Your Safety which engages, you know, leaders in the television and film industry, which you are, to sort of model gun safety on screen in order to change the culture, as we've been talking about. And you sign on to an open letter committing to make these changes. And so I'm wondering, since you sign on, what are some tangible or even intangible ways that that started to influence you or to change the way you think about maybe a scene or a script?

Speaker 2: 15:08

Yeah, well, like I said, I mean I have the enviable or unenviable position of not having to face this question too much, because most of the stuff I get sent my way is rather peaceful. But I just did a movie. It didn't change much. I mean, i did do a movie over the summer where I hold a gun the whole movie And I thought long and hard about it and I did it And I'm still just to be perfectly honest. So my justification was okay. There's one gun in the movie. I'm the bad guy. It's a grounded movie And it's an instrument of terror in it. Nothing good happens from it. Only people you love get killed, you know. So there are consequences for sure.

Speaker 2: 15:49

And it's more terrifying than anything. That's one side of it And I can justify it that way And I could counter argument go yeah, but I got some cool tattoos in it. It's shot well, i look kind of cool And that in of itself is an ad, and so it's not black and white. And if I had to tabulate it, i would say that it comes out more pro gun, but it comes out more of an advocate for gun than a detraction, even though it has those sort of stakes and consequences built into it. I'm still not denying that in many, in probably the stronger way, it is still. You know, i don't wanna say promotes, but you know it doesn't-.

Speaker 2: 16:36

Condemn maybe It certainly doesn't condemn And probably it's still a little bit glorifies, And so I don't know. But I did it And that one didn't cross the line for me, I would do it again. I wouldn't do a movie like Bullet Train, you know I'm not offered it, so it's not a problem. But like I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I don't think I would do something at this point with a lot of flippant gun violence for shits and giggles. I think I totally would have five years ago and 10 years ago I would have loved it, you know.

Speaker 2: 17:06

And now I see that I'm gonna go and I'm gonna just open up my thing and put my sniper thing together And it makes me sick, It makes me like to touch it. You know I don't get a good feeling from it. That's not a story I wanna tell, unless there's a great, unless there's a really good reason. But anyways, I don't know. It's unquantifiable these things, you know, And so just kind of making the best calculation I can. But time will tell. And do you answer your question about how tangible, like what it really looks like for me? And you know, I may never have to pass on something that's, you know, too gun-riddled. I'll bullet late in or whatever. Because of the nature of you know who I am, But we'll see.

Speaker 2: 17:50

But I can make fun of the people that do.

Speaker 3: 17:53

And I think too, in some ways, what you're saying is sort of what Brady is trying to do in some ways, which is change culture, because you said 10 years ago you would have been like this is awesome, and then five years ago you may not have thought about it as much, and now you're at a point where you're at least engaging and thinking about things differently, and I think that's kind of what we want to happen. It's just for at least for people to think, and not just on your side, but on our side too, and by our side I mean non-actors In Hollywood. But just, you know, if you're going, if you're thinking about buying a gun and you're afraid and you want it for self-defense, can we at least get someone to think about it, think about the weight of it and safe storage. So in some ways you're kind of modeling just what we want, which is just to really think about holistically firearms and culture around them, rather than just sort of being an autopilot.

Speaker 1: 18:47

I think there's something tangible too, though, and good and like actors or directors are like the folks who are involved in storytelling, even if they are portraying, say, like firearms ownership in a particular way, where it's seen as something that you really like, want, or that it's enviable, like coming out to say, and that's a character that I play and a thing that is made up, and it is not like how I live my life.

Speaker 1: 19:08

And so, while my character may do this thing and portrays gun ownership as a really cool thing, hey, can we talk about the fact that we lose eight kids a day, you know, to unsecured firearms in the home? So it's not as like entangled as I think of, like Charlton Heston And like the characters that he played and then who he was as a person for the NRA right. So it's not that like I'm a cowboy both on screen and in real life. You should wanna be like me. It's hey, like consume the media that I'm in, like I'm good at my job, like it, but know that like as a real person. These are also my opinions on this here, or some things that, like, you should read and check up with.

Speaker 2: 19:42

It's totally true. However, i still feel that you know the stories. You know that we tell on screen and have a wider you know, and that are promoted and that are cut into trailers and posters and plastered throughout the world has a wider reach than anything I'm gonna say here. You know, and so I don't know. I am concerned first and foremost with that and, quite simply, making it a little less hip. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of all these guys fucking raiding buildings with their cool trigger fingers. They're dorks they're dorks.

Speaker 2: 20:25

And it is such a crutch for masculinity and I don't know they just never reckon with, like the truth, the reality of that you know, And yeah, it's the leading cause of death for kids. It's time to have an adult, a big boy conversation and an adult conversation about this stuff And yeah, but I'm all for anything, any little bit here and there, in the same way that I think the bill that was passed recently seems pretty small, but I'll take it And anything, anything, anything will save lives.

Speaker 1: 21:08

You're talking about the safer community. Is that what it was like as a house?

Speaker 2: 21:11

Anything. I'm sure that saved lives, you know, and so I don't know. It was interesting again to be in this meeting and everyone had different And again some people like Matt are coming from gun shows, you know, and there are a lot of people from Yellowstone represented and so different cultures, different genres and they obviously have a slightly different take. They're not necessarily clamoring for less, but they're clamoring for slightly different representation. And I'll take it save storage, make it cool, great.

Speaker 3: 21:43

Yeah, and I think some of what you're saying too about the stories that we tell in the culture. I mean, I totally see that as someone, as a black woman, for example, and like the media depictions and the way that you get these sort of stereotypes disseminated through culture and people don't even realize that they've picked up certain ideas about people, but it's been through entertainment. So, Because we have spoken to a lot of survivors, people who have been shot but are now paraplegic or suffering lifelong, whether it's physical or mental or both Consequences is that on TV a lot of times when someone is shot, they pop back up.

Speaker 2: 22:21

You know if it's like a detective show.

Speaker 3: 22:23

It's like oh, i was out for a day and now I'm back on the beat. Yeah, we were talking about that a lot.

Speaker 2: 22:27

He was in fact, matt Nix and I were just talking and he was saying, in Breaking Bad, the brother-in-law I think it's the one guy Anyway he gets shot and then he recovers for like a season, you know, and then he thought that was, and I agree, and not all shows can be breaking bad and not all shows can do that kind of thing.

Speaker 2: 22:49

But yeah, i do think We also talked a lot as a group about, yeah, not only the recovery but the trauma to the body. And you know, it's this weird conundrum with, like it's a rating system thing. So like, if you shoot someone and there's like a little speck of blood, you can get PG-13. And then your movie can make, your movie can be advertised. It allows you to be advertised more places at different times, make more money. If you show it realistically, it's an automatic R And so there's a real financial disincentive, even though they still want the violence to like to completely sanitize it, and so it's kind of the worst of both worlds. I mean, it's a conundrum and I feel like the studios and the rating systems need a bit of an adjustment to. You know, because that's, yeah, that seems backwards.

Speaker 3: 23:45

Yeah, and it's interesting. Sorry, i'm going script here Because I'm not in Hollywood, i don't understand all the rating stuff, but I think it's interesting that there's such a. It's PG-13 for a little bit of blood, r for a lot, and we'll regulate that. But then when students are like, please, i don't want to die in my classroom, i don't want to see my friends die in my classroom, that's, that's fine, that's not PG-13. That's like elementary school students. You know, we're fine with them seeing real death. We don't want to do anything about that, but we will.

Speaker 2: 24:13

Yeah, we can't have it on the movies, yeah, although although even that, you know, i mean, i know this is very controversial and I don't know what it would look like literally, or just, you know, conceptually. But the idea of, like, what if we have to look at more of this carnage? I don't know, i don't want to look at it, but I mean, would it have an impact? Probably, if I don't mean, i don't mean the movie depictions, i mean the real stuff. I don't know, like I said, i don't know the practicality of that, but I do know that sounds impactful.

Speaker 1: 24:49

See, i wish and this is like I wish that I wish that if it, if people saw it, it would matter. But I just but I don't. I think we are now living in a world such where it's become normalized to the point where I think people have like shooting fatigue. So we know that there's a mass shooting practically every day.

Speaker 1: 25:08

Yeah, sure, sure, make the news, but I also think that, like post Sandy Hook and we still couldn't get a band pack, like I I think that certainly to people on the ground, there might be a groundswell if they saw those images and went this is what I mean, kelly and I have talked to survivors who have been like this is what my this is the last image I have of my kid Like I had to do a DNA test to identify my child Like wow, and they go to talk to their electeds and their electeds don't vote. So I think it would absolutely have a groundswell thing. I don't think to the, to certain people in power who have that voting power right now Yeah, i think the ones who have said no so far. I don't think that would move to a yes.

Speaker 2: 25:43

Oh, i don't. I think those ones who said no to personally demonize them. I know you guys I don't know if you can or not, but I will. I think they're, you know, amoral ghouls and the fact that I know it's only a handful of them, but they, they, they in many ways represent, are representative of their entire party. The trend of of of AR 15 pins, which is a, is a, a mascot of murdered children. I know they claim it means other things, but it's actually to troll. It's actually to troll.

Speaker 2: 26:12

Uh, fucking people and and and who care about dead kids. It's so ghoulish I can't think I can't think of anything more ghoulish, more awful. I wear, and wear, a Nazi flag. It's a. this is where's Swastika? There's no difference to me. It's that outland. it's that obscene, it's that evil.

Speaker 2: 26:36

And uh, i don't think there's anything changing their minds. I don't think they have them, i just think they want power. They don't care, like I don't think they're they care about anyone, but I do think a groundswell and you know, back to the movies and culture, it's like if enough people and I don't know what it's going to take to to to reach critical mass, but I think we have to reach critical mass. you know, i know and forgive me if I said this earlier on the same podcast versus a conversation I had an hour ago but like I know that we have certain democratic you know it's sort of like it's a bit of minority rule with peculiarities to our, to our government, and there's a bit of minority rule, and I know that, yes, of course, the, the majority of Americans want some version of uh gun, safety gun, whatever, whatever benign uh descriptor suits you.

Speaker 2: 27:24

But, um, less murder And but not enough. And again, i know it's a bit of minority rule, but it's, it's not so so, so, lopsided, still not enough to like vote these people out, and that is mind blowing to me. And again, that's where I feel like, well, let's talk culturally, then let's talk attitudes, um, but what say you? I mean what? what is it going to take? What are? when does this reach critical mass and do we have to? is it, is it just Vietnam? And it's just about putting a million more people into the furnace until people go? okay, now, i've had it. Now. Now, or is there? what is the fucking problem?

Speaker 1: 28:05

I mean that's a million dollar question. I'll just sit here and sit here, I mean part of it.

Speaker 3: 28:11

Part of it, I do think, is I mean, it's just the structural problem, right, And like part of the structural issues come from all the other issues, like racism, for example, like why isn't DC a state?

Speaker 3: 28:21

You know, so there's some of it is just we have these structures, we have voter suppression, we have ways of making sure that not everybody has a say.

Speaker 3: 28:31

That aside, i do think with guns and some of the entrenched, the fact that a lot of people may not vote something that we've come across in our work is we talk to people or we're in spaces.

Speaker 3: 28:44

You know you'll be in a legislative space where there are people who are ghoulish. There. We're not trying to, we can't get them, but there are some people that genuinely believe that, for whatever reason maybe it's because of the gun companies, maybe it's because of some cultural thing with their grandpa that having a gun does make them safer. And if you're trying to have a gun law, you are impeding in their capacity to protect their family And so you are a threat to them. And that's where I think a lot of this cultural work is actually really important because, to your point, the gun industry has had a head start. Some of our mythologies have had a head start for decades and centuries in some ways of convincing people that, like this, gun is going to make you safer. And so for the people that are coming at this and they're coming at it with good faith and working in the space for a while. I know it.

Speaker 3: 29:34

I've talked to a lot of friends and they're like I don't get it And I'm like I don't either, but I have had to enter in And there are people that genuinely do think like this is keeping me safe, and if you are passing a law, what you're actually doing is you're on the slippery slope, which you're ultimately trying to do is take away my capacity to keep my family safe, and so that's where I think, helping to show the risk and to show the consequences in a way that's not threatening because, like for some people, they're not. If it's coming at them from me or someone, they're going to say, like you're a gunrapper, versus a story, so right, right.

Speaker 3: 30:11

There is a deep belief for a lot of people.

Speaker 2: 30:14

Yeah, Does that come from? yeah, where do you think it comes from?

Speaker 1: 30:18

I mean.

Speaker 2: 30:19

I guess a lot of places. But yeah, i think.

Speaker 1: 30:21

I mean starting from the fact that we're a nation founded on settler colonialism And then that really needed to, for a variety of reasons, to buy into the mythos of like this individualism. Everybody had a gun wild white, like you need that for a variety of reasons And then you need it. I think in the modern era, like I think from the 60s on, when the NRA started pounding money into kind of that two prong system that yes, a gun will make you safer in the home and that a good guy with a gun can prevent. I mean that came post Sandy Hook and Parkland but like that a good guy with a gun will, despite the fact that that is not true there have been, now that so many poor grad students have spent so much time writing like on like this, that these two things are not true.

Speaker 1: 31:08

But when you've spent enough money on the ad campaign and you've had, like, the conferences and the cons and everything else, that this is consistent, it gets so tied in then with your view of self and like who you are. I'm a protector, I need this And again as Kelly said it.

Speaker 1: 31:25

So it makes cognitive sense that anyone attempting to remove this is attempting to chip away of who I am as an American, as an American, and then you started adding layers as an American man, as an American white man, the protector, and the law is interesting too.

Speaker 2: 31:37

it's like I mean, i know it sounds self evident and there's not much difference between that And I'm safe, i'm keeping my family safe. But the protector thing is a. It's a powerful, you know it's a powerful state. You are a police officer, you are. You know you are a sheriff, you are. It's an authority position and and a power position. You know that. I guess, yeah, you feel less powerful without it. I mean, i get that.

Speaker 3: 32:06

To your point about the stories that we tell. I mean it does? it will make a difference, because even you know I'm thinking of Jennifer Carlson she's a sociologist and she did a lot of work around gender and gun violence and how the gun industry sort of markets self defense.

Speaker 3: 32:22

Yeah, they focus on crime that primarily affects only white men, and that's the type of it's stranger danger, right? So this idea of you're walking down the street, someone comes after you, you need a firearm. Well, a lot of crime happens between people who know each other, or it's interpersonal or sorry, intimate partner violence, and those are not, you know.

Speaker 3: 32:43

A lot of times in the movies or in TV it's like the homeowner, it's the someone breaks in, they got it, they protect their family they're not really showing like domestic violence or you know, intimate partner violence, and so it kind of can spur people to saying like I'm going to, i want to do that, i want to buy a gun so I can protect my family, and it's like the call is coming from inside the house.

Speaker 2: 33:03

Yeah totally, totally, totally, totally, totally, totally. Yeah, it's, these are, these are fantasies, that that we create and imprint on people and kids, and it's, it's a privilege to be able to do it, but it is a, it is a responsibility, it is a power And I think that, you know, i just think a deeper, deeper thought about it is warranted and exciting, by the way, i actually find it exciting. I don't find this drab, i don't find this to be a bummer, like I think, and I don't think it means that every show has to. You know it has to be all about lockboxes and and and and and tears, after you know. But I just think there's a whole world of, you know, stories and heroes and villains and and and and and. Let's get creative, is there?

Speaker 1: 33:59

any? do you have any hopes, like, in particular, where you could see like an initiative like this going pie in the sky or Yeah, I would love.

Speaker 2: 34:08

I have no idea the feasibility of it, but because it doesn't necessarily have to involve the government, I think it would involve more of studios and you don't have to deal with that, You deal with the MPAA and you deal with studios and it's a packed shame.

Speaker 2: 34:23

I don't care whatever it is, but but um, where again I would say to me pie in the sky but feels doable in the next five, 10 years is outdoor, outdoor ads.

Speaker 2: 34:35

I feel like that or like, even maybe like prime time, you know, like make it a bit more of a rated R, make it a cigarette, and like we'll start with outdoor and then we can talk about what times of TV can you show, whatever.

Speaker 2: 34:48

But like that is one that feels doesn't seem to repel or not repel, um recoil or fucking gun terminology, um, um, anyways, it doesn't seem to turn off people too much. You know, i've been floating in and I've it's, it's peaked some interest and um, yeah, i feel like if we could take it off of billboards, and you know, and then, other than that, and I think even more, you know, uh, achievable is just the conversation of, and the Dweeba fine of, of locking and loading in your trailers and in all your stories and in all your you know for all, and I'll just you know, um, yeah, that just just just. you're not as cool as you think And it's it's, you know, think about the downstream effects. just think about it, and and, and see if it's all necessary. you know, um, and if everyone could dial it back by a matter of degrees, that would be great.

Speaker 1: 35:53

I think that those like small, achievable steps though, like just building one thing after another, that's how you know tangible change actually happens. So that's great. And I mean seriously, adam, we can't. We can't thank you enough for putting your time and attention behind this and for coming on today Hey want to share with the podcast. Listeners can now get in touch with us here at Red, blue and Brady via phone or text message. Simply call or text us at 480-744-3452 with your thoughts. Questions concerns ideas, cat pictures, whatever.

Speaker 3: 36:27

Thanks for listening. As always, brady's life-saving work in Congress, the courts and communities across the country is made possible thanks to you. For more information on Brady or how to get involved in the fight against gun violence, please like and subscribe to the podcast. Get in touch with us at BradyUnitedorg or on social at BradyBuzz. Be brave and remember. Take action, not size.